CakePHP

Disappointed with the training.

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Nate

Disappointed with the training.

Well it looks like the CakePHP training came available for
registration, and I am rather disappointed in how the training
actually is.

The beginner, intermediate, and advanced courses are all scheduled
courses - each an hour long, from 4pm to 5pm, at $89 a pop.

3 courses, 3 hours, $267 dollars.

Cake, I hope you take into consideration the folks that can't afford
that kind of price tag, for such a short lesson, at a pretty
inconvenient hour.

I work 5 days a week...a typical 9-5 job. So by the time I get home
and want to learn some CakePHP, the lesson is already over. (I am
GMT-5, so that means the lesson would take place around noon time,
right in the middle of my work day)

I'll just use Lynda.com as my example, because I've used it for years.
The monthly price tag is fair. The videos are instant (I can watch
them at any time, at my convenience). And it's hours upon hours of
information and lessons.

Furthermore, it seems by the description that a lot of what is being
taught can be easily read in the Documentation. So, what am I getting
for a 1 hour, $89 lesson? Who is it aimed at?

--
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Check out the new CakePHP Questions site http://ask.cakephp.org and help others with their CakePHP related questions.

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John Hardy

Re: Disappointed with the training.

I'm not trying to flame. However learning to program is not like learning pottery…
There are certain fundamentals that need to be in place first.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_science

On Jan 4, 2012, at 7:34 AM, Nate wrote:

> Well it looks like the CakePHP training came available for
> registration, and I am rather disappointed in how the training
> actually is.
>
> The beginner, intermediate, and advanced courses are all scheduled
> courses - each an hour long, from 4pm to 5pm, at $89 a pop.
>
> 3 courses, 3 hours, $267 dollars.
>
> Cake, I hope you take into consideration the folks that can't afford
> that kind of price tag, for such a short lesson, at a pretty
> inconvenient hour.
>
> I work 5 days a week...a typical 9-5 job. So by the time I get home
> and want to learn some CakePHP, the lesson is already over. (I am
> GMT-5, so that means the lesson would take place around noon time,
> right in the middle of my work day)
>
> I'll just use Lynda.com as my example, because I've used it for years.
> The monthly price tag is fair. The videos are instant (I can watch
> them at any time, at my convenience). And it's hours upon hours of
> information and lessons.
>
> Furthermore, it seems by the description that a lot of what is being
> taught can be easily read in the Documentation. So, what am I getting
> for a 1 hour, $89 lesson? Who is it aimed at?
>
> --
> Our newest site for the community: CakePHP Video Tutorials http://tv.cakephp.org
> Check out the new CakePHP Questions site http://ask.cakephp.org and help others with their CakePHP related questions.
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> [hidden email] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php

--
Our newest site for the community: CakePHP Video Tutorials http://tv.cakephp.org
Check out the new CakePHP Questions site http://ask.cakephp.org and help others with their CakePHP related questions.

To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
[hidden email] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php

Nate

Re: Disappointed with the training.

Right John.

But I'm not needing a "how to program" tutorial. If you're using
CakePHP, chances are you're already familiar with the concepts of
programming with PHP - you're just looking for a way to speed up your
programming process. Exactly what CakePHP is made for.

I'm still not sure what I'm getting for $89 per lesson. The
descriptions are rather vague.

Is it a requirement that I take the beginner course to get to the
intermediate course? Because the intermediate course builds off of
what you accomplished in the beginner course.

I don't really have a problem with taking the beginner course. My
main disappointment lies in the fact that the lessons are not easily
accessible. They're scheduled for an odd hour, one time, and
expensive. Maybe if the lesson was saved and available for download at
a later time?

That's all my disappointment really is...just accessibility for people
who want to learn.

--
Our newest site for the community: CakePHP Video Tutorials http://tv.cakephp.org
Check out the new CakePHP Questions site http://ask.cakephp.org and help others with their CakePHP related questions.

To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
[hidden email] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php

Larry E. Masters

Re: Disappointed with the training.

Larry E. Masters

On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 10:33 AM, Nate <[hidden email]> wrote:

Right John.

But I'm not needing a "how to program" tutorial. If you're using
CakePHP, chances are you're already familiar with the concepts of
programming with PHP - you're just looking for a way to speed up your
programming process. Exactly what CakePHP is made for.

I'm still not sure what I'm getting for $89 per lesson. The
descriptions are rather vague.

Is it a requirement that I take the beginner course to get to the
intermediate course? Because the intermediate course builds off of
what you accomplished in the beginner course.

I don't really have a problem with taking the beginner course. My
main disappointment lies in the fact that the lessons are not easily
accessible. They're scheduled for an odd hour, one time, and
expensive. Maybe if the lesson was saved and available for download at
a later time?

That's all my disappointment really is...just accessibility for people
who want to learn.

This is just our initial launch for the courses, sorry if we can not cover every time zone and every language we have a limited team for the initial launch. I will be posting an article on bakery soon explaining what we have done and where we are going with the training, the different timezones, languages and all the other features we have.

If you want to learn for no "cost" you should look at http://tv.cakephp.org/events to see the workshops that have been presented at CakeFest. I will be putting the workshops from 2011 online in the near future too. You will also find many other videos on the site and far more than the 1 hour initial sessions that are offered for a fee on the live training site, watch them at your own leisure

Larry E. Masters

Nate

Re: Disappointed with the training.

Thanks Larry.

I understand that not every time zone and every language can be
covered.

I think the live training lessons are a pretty great idea, but I just
wonder about those that are unable to attend the lesson when it's
scheduled.

"no cost" is not what I'm talking about, either. There are quite a few
web sites out there that offer a monthly and/or per video
subscription. They're affordable and offer really good lessons.
Problem is, none of them offer any good CakePHP tutorials. Most video
tutorials that are available (to include the free seminars you
mention) are Cake version 1.2 or 1.3. I've yet to see a memorable 2.0
video tutorial. And I guess that's what I was expecting and hoping for
from the Cake Training.

But as you said - it's only an initial release. I understand that. I
don't think what you're offing is "bad". I am just disappointed
because I was looking forward to getting some lessons from the best
possible instructors, and I only find out that it's at a time that I
can't see it, and it's out of my price range.

It is what it is. I still enjoy using CakePHP. I'll just have to find
a different way to get better.

--
Our newest site for the community: CakePHP Video Tutorials http://tv.cakephp.org
Check out the new CakePHP Questions site http://ask.cakephp.org and help others with their CakePHP related questions.

To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
[hidden email] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php

Paul Vaughan

Re: Disappointed with the training.

In reply to this post by Larry E. Masters

Larry,

Really glad to see training is now available, but as the OP suggested it would be good to see a more detailed agenda for the sessions, so I can better choose which is/are right for me. Also, if there were savings for doing two or all three sessions, that would help me pitch the training to the people who hold the purse-strings.

Additionally would the code AND the video be made available after the session? That would probably help too.

(Have been planning a conference recently so I'm thinking over all these things myself...).

A bit off topic but I have a Cake-based project I would really love a core developer to critique. I believe this service was offered in the past, so will it be again, and what might the approximate cost be? I have received a lot of help here and through Google but ideally need someone more experienced than me to check it for silly mistakes before going live.

Cheers,

On Jan 4, 2012 5:07 PM, "Larry E. Masters" <[hidden email]> wrote:

--
Larry E. Masters

On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 10:33 AM, Nate <[hidden email]> wrote:

Right John.

But I'm not needing a "how to program" tutorial. If you're using
CakePHP, chances are you're already familiar with the concepts of
programming with PHP - you're just looking for a way to speed up your
programming process. Exactly what CakePHP is made for.

I'm still not sure what I'm getting for $89 per lesson. The
descriptions are rather vague.

Is it a requirement that I take the beginner course to get to the
intermediate course? Because the intermediate course builds off of
what you accomplished in the beginner course.

I don't really have a problem with taking the beginner course. My
main disappointment lies in the fact that the lessons are not easily
accessible. They're scheduled for an odd hour, one time, and
expensive. Maybe if the lesson was saved and available for download at
a later time?

That's all my disappointment really is...just accessibility for people
who want to learn.

This is just our initial launch for the courses, sorry if we can not cover every time zone and every language we have a limited team for the initial launch. I will be posting an article on bakery soon explaining what we have done and where we are going with the training, the different timezones, languages and all the other features we have.

If you want to learn for no "cost" you should look at http://tv.cakephp.org/events to see the workshops that have been presented at CakeFest. I will be putting the workshops from 2011 online in the near future too. You will also find many other videos on the site and far more than the 1 hour initial sessions that are offered for a fee on the live training site, watch them at your own leisure

--
Larry E. Masters

--
Our newest site for the community: CakePHP Video Tutorials http://tv.cakephp.org
Check out the new CakePHP Questions site http://ask.cakephp.org and help others with their CakePHP related questions.

To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
[hidden email] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/cake-php

Larry E. Masters

Re: Disappointed with the training.

In reply to this post by Nate

On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 12:19 PM, Nate <[hidden email]> wrote:

Thanks Larry.

I understand that not every time zone and every language can be
covered.

I think the live training lessons are a pretty great idea, but I just
wonder about those that are unable to attend the lesson when it's
scheduled.

"no cost" is not what I'm talking about, either. There are quite a few
web sites out there that offer a monthly and/or per video
subscription. They're affordable and offer really good lessons.
Problem is, none of them offer any good CakePHP tutorials. Most video
tutorials that are available (to include the free seminars you
mention) are Cake version 1.2 or 1.3. I've yet to see a memorable 2.0
video tutorial. And I guess that's what I was expecting and hoping for
from the Cake Training.

But as you said - it's only an initial release. I understand that. I
don't think what you're offing is "bad". I am just disappointed
because I was looking forward to getting some lessons from the best
possible instructors, and I only find out that it's at a time that I
can't see it, and it's out of my price range.

It is what it is. I still enjoy using CakePHP. I'll just have to find
a different way to get better.

Nate,

Sorry but if someone wants to learn they will make the time to attend I fail to see how this is an issue. I personally have never seen any project like CakePHP or company offer training to general public like this and make a schedule fit others instead of one that fits the people doing the training all do as we have, they set the schedule and people who want and can attend do so. Anyone who can not attend the first tutorials we offer can choose another date if they are offered again. This first 4 training sessions is only the start, and some of them may be repeated. Read my initial response, this is just a start and will eventually be offered in more times zones and multiple languages. This training is something we have been working on for a long time and with the release of 2.0 and advances in the tools we are using we felt the time was right to do it now.

Keep in mind this is not just sitting and watching a video tutorial, this is full interactive training by those of us who are providing you with CakePHP.

If you want something to fit your schedule you could hire http://cakedc.com to offer you training at any time or any where you like.

Larry E. Masters

Re: Disappointed with the training.

In reply to this post by Paul Vaughan

On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 12:47 PM, Paul Vaughan <[hidden email]> wrote:

Larry,

Really glad to see training is now available, but as the OP suggested it would be good to see a more detailed agenda for the sessions, so I can better choose which is/are right for me. Also, if there were savings for doing two or all three sessions, that would help me pitch the training to the people who hold the purse-strings.

Additionally would the code AND the video be made available after the session? That would probably help too.

(Have been planning a conference recently so I'm thinking over all these things myself...).

A bit off topic but I have a Cake-based project I would really love a core developer to critique. I believe this service was offered in the past, so will it be again, and what might the approximate cost be? I have received a lot of help here and through Google but ideally need someone more experienced than me to check it for silly mistakes before going live.

Cheers,

P.

Paul,

We will work on a more detailed outline of the course and update this week. Currently there is no discount for multiple course, but we are discussing the idea of subscription based training if there is enough interest.

All code used will be available under the MIT license and released from the official training account https://github.com/CakePHP-Courses

We also plan to record all training sessions too.

CakeDC offers code review if you need that, http://cakedc.com

Larry E. Masters